|
< Previous Post | Next Post >
Wednesday, January 9. 2008Huckabee: United States Does Integration Better than EuropePosted by Kyle Atwell in Transatlantic Relations, US Domestic and Cultural Issues on Wednesday, January 9. 2008
Mike Huckabee is a political rockstar in the United States. Even atheist Democrats who disagree with many of his policies cannot help but be charmed by the former governor. My friend and a fellow blogger Kevin (one such atheist Democrat) gives his take on this phenomenon at the blog Wyatt Gwyon:
Of the Republican candidates, Huckabee is the most straightforward in presentation and generally the most rigorous in his analyses… I certainly do not concur with the majority of the political positions that stereotypically come with his fundamentalist Christian system of belief, but I am clear on what he believes and can respect his convictions to those beliefs for their principled consistency. Huckabee is a profoundly known factor.IMHO, style is what has buoyed Huckabee’s presidential bid. It is not a coincidence that his campaign picked up momentum only a week after he became “Chuck Norris Approved” in a humorous commercial run prior to him sweeping the Iowa primaries last week. Huckabee has nonetheless been criticized for lacking a solid foreign policy platform. This week, he dabbled on the issue of US-European relations by speculating who is better at cultural integration. As reported by the National Review Online: It is also difficult for us, with our culture of assimilation, to understand that life for European Muslims is different from life for American Muslims. Muslims in Britain or the Netherlands or Germany are second-class citizens because those countries have more homogenous populations that don’t readily integrate outsiders. Instead of melting pots, Europe has separate pots boiling over with alienation and despair. In some countries, like France, it is more a lack of economic integration, while in others, like Britain, it is more a lack of cultural integration, but whatever the reason, Europe is a much more fertile breeding ground for terror than the United States. Unintentionally, some of our closest allies are producing some of our clearest threats.I agree with Huckabee that Europe does a poorer job of integration than the US, and that this can breed violence. However, I find it difficult to pin exactly why the US is a more successful 'melting pot'. Perhaps one factor is upward mobility: I suspect an individual can transcend their parentage easier in the US than in most European countries, which in turn mitigates social and cultural stratification.
Comments (33)
Defined tags for this entry: American Dream, Crime, Elections, Huckabee, Humor, Immigrants, Religion
Trackbacks
Trackback specific URI for this entry
No Trackbacks
Comments
Display comments as
(Linear | Threaded)
Don S
- #1 - 2008-01-09 13:46 - (Reply)
"Perhaps one factor is upward mobility: I suspect an individual can transcend their parentage easier in the US than in most European countries, which in turn mitigates social and cultural stratification." Comments ()
Pat Patterson
- #1.1 - 2008-01-09 17:51 - (Reply)
Agreed, yet the pollen count in Riverside in the fall and spring is brutal. Comments ()
SC
- #1.2 - 2008-01-10 19:28 - (Reply)
Interesting take. I've one problem with it. The proliferation of universities, colleges, junior colleges and the like is a relatively recent phenomenon; and assimilation success in the US is much older. Comments ()
Don S
- #1.2.1 - 2008-01-10 20:25 - (Reply)
I'm not sure that is actually true, SC. It's true that there are a lot more universities in the US than there once were (a lot of the growth occured during the 60's and 70's). But many of those *new* universities were actually promotions from other kinds of schools. Teacher's colleges, junior colleges, various kinds of technical schools, etc. Comments ()
Pat Patterson
- #1.2.1.1 - 2008-01-10 22:47 - (Reply)
I agree with Don S here as, for example in California, the older JCs or community colleges were founded as early as the late 1890's into the early 20's. Well before the post war baby boom generation made higher education available and virtually mandatory for professional success. I can use my own family as an example as my grandfather, in the early part of the 20th century, was only able to finish 9th grade in Scotland and then went into the mines before emigrating to the US. While his sons were able to finish high school and one went on to a JC in California and then ultimately to a state college. None of this would have happened in Scotland if the family had stayed. Comments ()
SC
- #1.2.1.2 - 2008-01-11 04:19 - (Reply)
"So you're kind of correct but also kind of wrong in implying that the growth of universities is a recent phenomena; Calling them universities is recent, yes. But the schools existed well beforehand in most cases, I think." Comments ()
Don S
- #1.2.1.2.1 - 2008-01-11 13:00 - (Reply)
One reason I was so kinda kinda in the previous post is because while the schools did exist before 1960 it's also true that per-school enrollment expanded a great deal in the post-WWII era, so in that sense you're initial thesis is perfectly correct, SC. Comments ()
SC
- #1.2.1.3 - 2008-01-11 04:39 - (Reply)
Also, your points about the importance of elementary and secondary education as well as the "frontier" are hard to overstate when talking about assimilation or the building of, as you put it, a middling class. Comments ()
Detlef
- #1.3 - 2008-01-11 01:06 - (Reply)
Well, if the communist rag "The Economist" is right then upward mobility is now lower in the USA than in Europe. Comments ()
Kyle - Atlantic Review
- #1.3.1 - 2008-01-11 02:34 - (Reply)
Interesting article in Spiegel Online says: Comments ()
Zyme
- #1.3.1.1 - 2008-01-11 08:45 - (Reply)
Is this a surprise? Around 40% of all children here have a migration background. Which people on this planet would blindly tolerate such developments? Comments ()
SC
- #1.3.2 - 2008-01-11 04:49 - (Reply)
Interesting points, Detlief. But you've left me, at least, to wonder what you make of them. You've got some data there. What's your interpretation? Comments ()
Don S
- #1.3.3 - 2008-01-11 14:30 - (Reply)
"Well, if the communist rag "The Economist" is right then upward mobility is now lower in the USA than in Europe." Comments ()
Zyme
- #2 - 2008-01-09 19:22 - (Reply)
It would be quite suprising if the US was doing a worse job at integrating foreign people. How could a country be more accommodating than by having a philosophy of mixing everything in a melting pot? Comments ()
Reid of America
- #3 - 2008-01-10 00:08 - (Reply)
I believe the US has a much higher caliber of Muslim immigrants than does Europe. In the US, Muslims have above average incomes and below average social problems such as crime and poverty. Muslims only make up 1% of the US population. Comments ()
quo vadis
- #4 - 2008-01-10 02:21 - (Reply)
There are a number of reasons, but I think perhaps the most important is the nature and origin of American culture and of Americans themselves. Comments ()
Don S
- #4.2 - 2008-01-10 12:13 - (Reply)
"makes it difficult for any of us to regard those whose families immigrated more recently as somehow less authentically American." Comments ()
Zyme
- #4.2.1 - 2008-01-10 17:35 - (Reply)
Could it be then that the original identity of the land of emigrants is vanishing and a cultural establishment takes over in the US as well? Comments ()
Don S
- #4.2.1.1 - 2008-01-10 19:03 - (Reply)
Hmm, interesting question, Zyme. Comments ()
Anonymous
- #4.2.1.1.1 - 2008-01-10 19:22 - (Reply)
Don S: Comments ()
SC
- #4.2.1.1.2 - 2008-01-10 20:05 - (Reply)
Don, don't confuse last summer's opposition to Congressional legislation with blanket opposition to immigration: overlap to be sure; but not the same as Anonymous, in part, points out. Comments ()
Don S
- #4.2.1.1.2.1 - 2008-01-10 20:56 - (Reply)
"Hispanic immigrants, particularly from Mexico, may turn out to be the most assimilable of all the immigrant waves so far." Comments ()
Kyle - Atlantic Review
- #4.2.1.1.3 - 2008-01-14 16:57 - (Reply)
I received an email today with some immigration statistics that may help explain some of the US backlash: Comments ()
Kyle - Atlantic Review
- #4.2.1.1.4 - 2008-01-14 16:59 - (Reply)
I received an email today with some immigration statistics that may help explain some of the US backlash: Comments ()
quo vadis
- #4.2.1.2 - 2008-01-10 21:45 - (Reply)
Not likely anytime soon. 1 in 5 Americans is either an immigrant since th 1960s or a descendant of one of those immigrants. Comments ()
Anonymous
- #4.2.2 - 2008-01-10 19:32 - (Reply)
That would be meso-American indian tribes which have what to do with northern American indian tribes? Comments ()
Don S
- #4.2.2.1 - 2008-01-10 20:34 - (Reply)
Meso-American indians are just as American as north American indians. People customarily use "American" instead of anything more precise; Latin Americans have an equal claim to American identity. If you count length of tenancy, more of a claim! Comments ()
Anonymous
- #4.2.2.1.1 - 2008-01-10 20:53 - (Reply)
Very true, but what claim do Mesos have in el Norte? Aztecs, Olmecs yada yada never made it to Arizona, California, Michigan or New Mexico. The Mestizoes did and got whupped. Comments ()
Don S
- #4.2.2.1.1.1 - 2008-01-10 21:32 - (Reply)
The classical view of how Indians spread into the Americas was that they were Asians who crossed the Bering Strait in Alaska. I don't know what the current scholarly view is, but if that theory is true than every American Indian of whatever nationality is descended from north American indians. Comments ()
Anonymous
- #4.2.2.1.1.1.1 - 2008-01-10 22:13 - (Reply)
Never said anything about having a more moral claim to inhabiting the continuous United States. Just attempted to point out that this La Razza race based historic perspective is tenuous per its own racist criteria (all central Americans are mestizoes other than .01%) and causally suspect (i.e since the Olmecs were subjugated by the later Aztecs, should the Olmecs descendants receive preferential treatment in central Mexico? Can DNA tell the two apart?). Comments ()
Elisabeth
- #5 - 2008-01-10 18:37 - (Reply)
The easy answer is the difference between a nation state modelled on ethnicity and territorial boundaries versus one inspired by an idea. The assimilative process for an immigrant to America becomes much easier due to the simple fact that all he has to do is profess his allegience to the American idea, take a test, and it is socially unacceptable to question his sincereity ( I have never seen it happen). Whereas in Europe, even second generation citizens are often referred to as foreigners or by their father's country of origin. Comments ()
Don S
- #5.1 - 2008-01-11 19:15 - (Reply)
"The evolving frontier allowed American culture to be more welcoming to immigrants in its inception--there is always more land and room. Comments ()
|
Contact UsEmail Joerg Wolf and Kyle Atwell at:
ar-team AT atlanticreview.org We are available for interviews, and appreciate feedback and suggestions. Subscribe and FollowWelcome!
You are reading the ATLANTIC REVIEW, a Press Digest on Transatlantic Relations combined with commentary and analysis. More about us. Follow Atlantic Review on Facebook or on Twitter. Subscribe to one of our RSS-Feeds or to our newsletter. SponsorSUPPORT THIS SITEBlogrollHot TopicsClick on one of the following links to see all Atlantic Review posts about this topic in a chronological order with the latest post on top:
Afghanistan Anti-Americanism Economics Iran Iraq Merkel Polls Terrorism Click here for the full list of all topics. |
Home - About Us - Newsletter - Transatlantic Relations - US Foreign Policy - Various RSS Feeds Designed for Atlantic Review by Carl.

